[cathycnm]

#1072446

Mickey – Synthroid is actually preferred to armor thyroid by the pharmacy folks. Armor is ground animal thyroid so the dosage is harder to control. Our bodies convert the T4 to T3 anyway – so it is not like we are missing anything.

There has been mixed findings on using different brands of thyroid. The problem is that our TSH is so sensitive that even a small difference in the preparation of the med might be enough to throw that out of kilter. And while the dosages are the same – the other ingrediants can make a difference. Some research says there is a difference and others does not. Until they can nail this down – it is generally recommended not to change brands – or if you do to monitor TSH more frequently. The problem with generics is sometimes they may change brands on those and cause TSH to fluxuate. So – I have not used the web pharmacies but I know sometimes they market things as the brand name that are not. I recently heard of a company that is selling an IUD (web-based company not in the US) and saying it is generic paraguard but it is not!!! It has very different specs and is not FDA approved. So, I have no idea on thyroid but hearing that made me leary. If you do use an online pharmacy – be sure they are reputable. I know my insurance company has an online company they work with and I would be comfortable with that.

As far as weight – it is what we take in vs what we burn off. When hypo (lovely, isn’t it?) everything slows down and we burn less. Once our levels are normal again – then we burn at the normal rate again. Of course – if we are not getting enough exercise or eating too much – then that would keep the excess weight on. And women’s metabolisms slow down some after menopause – I think our average BMI peaks at about age 55. Welcome to the board – let us know how it goes!

[Ski]

#1072447

Some people do swear by Armour, and in recent years they have had better success at normalizing the dose, but the issue is that supplementing T3 can be challenging. Most of us have no issues converting T4 to T3, so the result is the same. T3 is very volatile, and so even one pill a day is too infrequent to keep that level stable. Some people do have trouble converting T4 to T3, and for those people, Armour can be a blessing. There is also Cytomel, a solely T3 supplement, which some people take along with T4. Again, it’s a volatile substance. People here have tried it and experienced months of feeling better, only to end up with another rush of symptoms (palpitations, anxiety, etc.) that are relieved by discontinuing use of the T3. The doctors at our most recent conference suggested beginning with T4 replacement, and if, in the end, after a search for YOUR normal point (very important), you find it difficult to get to your perfect POINT, you may want to look at T3 supplementation. Beginning with it may confuse the issue of finding your best level.

[Mickey65]

#1072448

Thanks for the info.

On this one message board where thyroids are discussed, some people there get pretty volatile about Armor vs Synthroid and swear by Armor. And some have already tried talking me into going back to my doctor and demanding I get Armor instead!

I know that everybody is different, and like I said, I’m just willing to try what the doctor prescribed to me and see what happens and if I’m not feeling any better – than I will discuss things further with her.

I’ve been here since Dec 2008 – just haven’t posted much since I took the RAI and have been feeling better! ” title=”Very Happy” />

Hopefully I’ll be able to make it thru whatever is coming next – now that I’m hypo and starting on my "for life" meds!

[Mickey65]

#1019556

I did the RAI back in mid-Dec last year (as some of you might know), and as of March 26th, was started on .125 of Synthroid per my doctor.

She gave me two weeks of free samples to start out with. I’m already on my 2nd day of taking it, and feel a bit less wore down than I was a few days ago when I was officially "hypo" (after being hyper and having Graves). I think my TSH was at 35 or something like that.

I keep hearing people argue that Armor is better than Synthroid, but then again other people say they do fine on it. I’m just willing to try the Synthroid and see what happens for now.

I was told to only take the BRAND name stuff and no generics – since sometime the generics won’t work as well. I even have a co-worker with Graves and she told me that also and only takes the Synthroid and has for many years and does fine with it.

Will I start to lose weight now that I’m on this? I think I put back on about 20 lbs after my RAI started taking effect! I’m trying to watch what I eat, but I was hoping as the pills start to do their thing, day by day, my metabolism will start to pick up some speed now and the weight will come off!

Also, has anyone ever ordered their meds online thru Canadian pharmacies? I noticed on Drugworldcanada.com, you can get Synthroid .125 – the 100 day supply for $26 with free shipping. It looks pretty tempting, since even at Costco, I’d still be paying over twice that.

Thanks in advance for your answers! ” title=”Wink” /> ” title=”Wink” />

[DianneW]

#1072449

Mickey,

Another opinion: You’re wise to stick with a T4 pill at the beginning and see if you can feel well on that. ONLY if that doesn’t work for you should you consider Armour or any other product containing T3, because to do well on those they need to be spilt into at least 3 daily doses to remain stable in your system.

This is what I did. I didn’t feel well on Synthroid or Levothyroid, and my Free T3 was tested and found not to be in the normal range even with my Free T4 at above normal, and a TSH at the low end of normal. Switching to Armour allowed my Free T4 to go back into the normal range and brought my Free T3 into the normal range as well, while allowing my TSH to come up a little higher. I felt TONS better. But the trade-off is taking a thyroid pill every 8 hours without fail. Not many people want to do this. It requires managing meals so that all three pills are on an empty stomach.

All the studies that have been done so far on the advantages of T4 meds vs. combination T4/T3 meds so far have been done taking the T3 portion of the drug only once per day, which will make the patient hyperthyroid part of the day and hypothyroid the rest of the day. I’m not surprised that the studies found there was no advantage in the combination therapy. But still, most people will have trouble taking a thyroid pill faithfully more than once per day, and most people don’t need to. Recent studies show that most people have normal T3 levels when they take a T4 pill. Give that a chance. It’s much simpler and safer for most people.

You don’t have to take Synthroid, but you should stick to whatever you ARE taking, and generics should be avoided since you can’t be assured that the manufacturer wouldn’t be changed without your knowledge. (That’s the problem with generics in thyroid meds. It wouldn’t be a problem if you could be assured of the same brand every time.)

I personally have no knowledge of buying from Canadian pharmacies or what the legalities are, or what their standards are for drug quality. Perhaps some of the Canadians on this board could help with this one. Elf? James?

[Mickey65]

#1072450

I’ve been on Synthroid for a week now, and feel a lot better. The first few days I felt a bit sluggish and "foggy headed" and was having some weird dreams.

My bladder also seemed to "freeze up" on me too – meaning I wasn’t peeing very much, altho I was drinking a lot of fluids!

But everything is fine now.

I decided to just buy my meds from my local pharmacy. $25 for the 30 tabs of Synthroid a month – that doesn’t hurt too much! ” title=”Wink” />

[Mickey65]

#1072451

I was wondering if Cytomel helps with weight loss – if your T3 isn’t converting from JUST taking Synthroid?

I’ve been pretty good about sticking to my low-carb diet, and taking my Synthroid faithfully every night at the same time, but my weight loss has now stopped, and I’m wondering if it has something to do with my T3’s?

I have an appointment with my endo this coming Wednesday, but I’m almost afraid to ask her about Cytomel and if she ends up being one of those endo’s who won’t prescribe it.

[Ski]

#1072452

If you truly have an issue within your body related to the conversion of T4 to T3, then yes, Cytomel can help. If you do NOT, Cytomel can create all kinds of problems for you. Your doctor will likely want to confirm any difficulties your body may have in conversion before using Cytomel. A friend here took Cytomel, felt fine for about six months, and then experienced a recurrence of all the troublesome hyper symptoms. Once she stopped taking the Cytomel, all of those symptoms disappeared. So even if you feel well at first, you may not continue to be helped by Cytomel unless you really need assistance with T3 specifically.

[alice1976]

#1072453

I had a TT last October and then I started with 125 T4. I was feeling pretty bad for a long time (about five months) even though results of the lab were good. I finalised my dose at 150 but I did not feel good anyway. I did not know what to do. Suddenly without changing anything, TSH went up to 8 and T4 – T3 were same as before (with low TSH). I went to my doctor and he said that the problem would be this particular box of T4. So he said that I need to change the label of T4 and not the dose. I was disappointed with my Doctor and I decided to take a second opinion. I visit another doctor and he said to me that GRAVES gives to the patient some antibodies that suppress TSH. So during the first 6 months we adjust dose of T4 in connection with FT4 and FT3results and not with TSH results. That means that I was hypothyroid for all these months and that is why I felt bad. After this new adjustment (t4 of 175) I was pretty good. So, if I were you, for the first six months, I would ask my doctor to adjust my dose not in connection with TSH result but with FT4 and FT3 results. If I had done this, I wouldn’t have lost all these hair I lost, I would nbot have gained some weight, and my eyes would have returned to normal easier!!!! All the best to you!

[Ski]

#1072454

We don’t have antibodies that suppress TSH (our antibodies actually mimic TSH), but TSH does take a while to respond to changes in T4 levels, so at first we should definitely be adjusting meds on the basis of both TSH and T4 tests to make sure the doctor can see the entire picture. With some Graves’ patients, the TSH stays low even after it ought to have risen, and it was once believed that the pituitary was somehow "asleep" due to the extended period of hyperthyroidism, taking longer to "wake up" than the treatment allowed. So again, dosing based on T4 levels was far more accurate in the first six months or so. After that, TSH is the right level to use, as it is more sensitive and allows the doctor to identify small adjustments that need to be made. If your doctor does not see both levels in your blood tests, and you’ve just had RAI or surgery, ask the doctor to add T4 to the lab order next time. It’s easily done for the lab, and a cheap test to run. It’s worth it to be more accurate with your levels.

[Mickey65]

#1072455

Thanks Ski! I just added your thing about checking my T4’s to my list of questions for the doctor. About every other time I go see her, I always have a list of things to ask about! ” title=”Wink” />

[Mickey65]

#1072456

I saw my endo today, and after telling her how tired I’ve been, constipated, losing hair and not losing any weight, she decided to up my dosage from 125 mcg to 150 mcg of my Synthroid since it’s apparent that I need more.

I asked her about Cytomel and she said she’d supplement it for me IF I really needed it, once it was figured out the Synthroid wouldn’t be enough, but for now, I have to be patient and see what happens.

She’s also going to be checking my Vitamin D levels on the blood they took from me today to see if I need any of that, and even mentioned to me that people in Texas have the lowest levels of vitamin D!

So for now, I’ll see how this higher dosage works for me. I don’t have to go back to see her again for another 4-6 months now, unless the higher dosage still isn’t working for me.

I’m one of those types of people with a high tolerance for meds and usually need more for it to "work"!

[cathycnm]

#1072457

Mickey – Interesting on Texas and the Vit D – I would have thought that being that far south, they would score higher. It is the sunshine vitamin. I know the Canadians have done some interesting research on it due to the prevalance of the deficiency there. It is a common deficiency since we started using more sun screen – so folks often need supplements. I wonder if Texans are just using more sunscreen or less products fortified in the vitamin. Interesting, though. I lived in Galveston for a time – what is the saying about the politician "You go to __ll and I’ll go to Texas" – I still have a magnet on my frig with that saying ” title=”Smile” />

[Ski]

#1072458

Just a quick note ~ I now understand that, in addition to the Graves’ antibodies that mimic TSH and stimulate the thyroid to produce hormone, Graves’ patients are also known to have antibodies that can suppress TSH. People who have low levels of these antibodies typically do not experience a suppressed TSH level. People who have high levels of these particular antibodies can have an artificially suppressed TSH, so that result is not always reliable all by itself for those patients. There is, apparently, very little testing of these particular antibodies in the medical community. In the end, asking the doctor to make sure they’re testing TSH and T4/T3 will give you a better shot at correct dosing, even if you don’t have specific knowledge about your levels of these particular antibodies. I think anytime you’re having symptoms and suspect an imbalance, it makes sense to try and have all levels tested so the doctor can see the whole picture.

[Mickey65]

#1072459

My endo said she’s waiting to get my TSH readings in order before she goes to my T3’s and T3’s. Maybe she’ll know more after this recent blood work I did yesterday?

And on a sidenote Cathy, there’s another saying in Texas that someone said to me this morning, "Come on vacation – leave on probation!"

One of my co-workers had a cousin get into trouble when she came out to visit one time…

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