[Ski]

#1072721

Absolutely, probably no coincidence. Hyperthyroidism leaches calcium from the bones as well as wasting our muscles. It depends on how long you were hyperthyroid, for the most part, as far as Graves’ being "responsible." There are, of course, other issues that may come into play as well (in other words, hyperthyroidism is not the only cause of osteoporosis). Once your thyroid hormone levels are under control, there should be no further damage done in terms of loss of calcium due to hyperthyroidism.

[Liz]

#1019590

I am wondering whether there could be a link between Graves and Osteoporosis? I was diagnosed with Graves in July ’08 and with Osteoporosis in Sept ’08. That seems like a big concidence……

I had RAI in October ’08, and am currently taking Synthroid and a once-a-week osteo medication along with calcium and vitamin D.

[cathycnm]

#1072722

Liz – I concur with Ski. I would like to add that osteoporosis is something like 80% genetic – so most people with osteoporosis can blame their ancestors. That said – if you have Graves then that is a big risk factor in and of itself and can lead to osteoporosis.

I had osteoporosis first – was on treatment and failed to improve so that is when I went to the endo and we found the Graves. I had some symptoms – but had no idea. My TSH was 100% normal the year before. The med usually increases bone by about 10-20% in the first year. I increased less than 2% – so in my case the Graves may well have resulted in 8-18% less bone in less than one year!!! That may be overstated a bit because bone scans mid therapy can appear lower than the improvement. Still – that is a chunk of skeleton.

I don’t know your age – but menopause and the 5-10 years after are the times for biggest bone loss in women. So if you are in this window, have Graves and have the genetics for osteoporosis – that can result in big bone loss rapidly because there are lots of factors at work. Good luck – be sure they check your vitamin D level, too – many of us are deficient and need more than the RDA for supplement. I take some horrific dose everyday just to stay in normal range because I lack some of the chemicals to convert D to its active form in my system. But have your doctor guide you on dosages for vit D and calcium based on your blood levels because vit D overdose can cause toxicity. Good luck! It is a journey. Cathy

[elf]

#1072723

I wonder how the bone loss is relevant to post-RAI people? Is the bone being lost at the same rate as when being hyper?

I think my bones are getting more fragile as I bumped my foot on the pile of wood (need to split wood here for winter LOL) – so I walked around with a foot bruise for about 2 weeks and I think my bones grew together but with an angle. I just personally feel that I would not have this breakage 8 years ago, before Graves.

But then again, maybe it’s the age and getting closer to menopause rather? This disease takes years and while we are waiting for improvements in Graves, the next thing we know it’s 8 or 10 years have passed and we may have naturally become more frail, but expect to feel like "before Graves", which was 8-10 years ago.

[cathycnm]

#1072724

Elf – You ask some good questions. Our bones reach a peak density when we are about 35 years old – from there out, all of us (men included) typically loose some mass every year. For women – estrogen is the major factor. Estrogen promotes bone density. When we go through menopause – estrogen drops because it is our ovaries that provide most of this hormone every month when we have periods. So, if your periods are more irregular (meaning you may not ovulating every month), then your estrogen may already be dropping. However – if you are past 35, you are probably dropping just because of age.

Bones are very alive – they are like any other tissue in our bodies. They are constantly breaking down and then adding new cells to replace the old ones. One type of cell (osteoblasts) build the new bone and another type (osteoclasts) break down the old bone. I think of construction workers – some knock down the old brick while others lay down new brick. In Graves (only when we are hyper) – the thyroid hormone speeds up the osteoclasts but not the osteoblasts. So – imagine we give a lot of coffee to those who break down brick and they speed up – but the ones building new go at the regular speed. That is how we loose bone with Graves – so once the stimulant (in our case, thyroid hormone) is normal – the two processes equalize.

I encourage you to talk with your doctor about a bone scan. With Graves and the possible break – it would seem reasonible. There are many good medications to help osteoporosis – this has really changed in the last few years, as we know a lot more about how bones work now. Many of these meds keep the osteoclasts from breaking down bone as quickly – and the earlier you catch this, the sooner you can slow down the process and the less bone you will be at risk to loose. With menopause in your future – this makes prevention of further loss even more important if you are already low. Good luck – let us know how it goes. Cathy

[cathycnm]

#1072725

PS – Be sure you are taking a good calcuim supplement with vitamin D every day. Talk to your doctor – general recommendations for folks 19-50 are 1,000 calcium/day and if over 50 – it jumps to 1,200. Remember we cannot absorb more than about 500 mg at a time – so split dosages are more effective. We also cannot effectively absorb calcium without vitamin D – and the RDA is now 400 IU daily – but there is serious consideration going into raising that pretty significantly – so talk to your doctor about their own recomendations. Also VERY IMPORTANT – calcium can cause your thyroid replacement to be less well absorbed so you need to wait 4 hours before taking your calcium.

Weight bearing exercise – walking, running, lifting weights, etc – is also very important to our bone mass. It is really important to stay with a program of weight bearing exercise if you have or are at risk for osteoporisis. Astronauts have a very hard time with osteoporosis because of the weightless environments they often work in – so they have developed a lot of ways to counteract this – mostly resistance exercises. Cathy

[elf]

#1072726

Cathy – thank you for laying it all out.

Just yesterday, went to a Natural Health Store and was told the same info, that calcium can’t be absorbed well by itself. Got a supplement with 1000 mg Calcium, 1000 IU vitamin D3, and it also contains boron, copper, magnesium, manganese, zinc, vit c, menatetrerone, glucozamine. (As I was explained these little minerals/vitamins help calcium absorption). (Though, this particular supplement you have to take 6 times a day which is going overboard I think, since who’d gonna remember to take it every 2 hours?)

I forgot I came there for a selenium supplement lol because that’s what I’m reading on the Graves boards about. This particular one I bought doesn’t have Selenium in it.

I’m 45 and have no changes in my periods still. I do realize I have to start paying attention to supplements and do weight lifting exersises (which I love by the way as opposite to running).

I had kids just recently, in my 40s, so I guess I was kind of hoping I was still in my peak female performance estrogen-wise but I guess time still goes by.

I’m so glad by the way I found that Health store as I am close to get completely frustrated with traditional doctors. They are too much under pressure from big pharmaceutical companies to sell certain kind of drugs. In two days, both me and my hubby feel much better from some health stuff we got there. It woulf be nice to have this alternative rather than feeling that we are not heard by the Drs.

[cathycnm]

#1072727

Elf – Sounds like you are boning up. There is some good info on supplements on the Ntl Osteoporosis Foundation site. The main thing in selecting supplements is that some calcium can be contaminated. Calcium citrate or calcium carbonate are safe. There are a couple of types of calcium that health food stores sell that is less safe. Oyster shell and one of the other ones carry more risk. So – I would suggest checking that. Otherwise – the mix sounds great!!! I lived in the healthfood store last summer when my endo put me on the low iodine diet before RAI – There is a lot of interesting stuff there. Just be wise – be sure you web search anything you are not familiar with and be sure to look for credible sites. Unfortunately, the health folks are out to make money just like the rest of the world and some of the claims are not correct. At the same time, I can understand the frustration with medicine. You are not alone with that. I, personally, like to balance the two but I do need to read a lot to be sure I am making wise choices. Sounds like you are off to a good start. Cathy

[cathycnm]

#1072728

One more PS – I like to call calcium and vit D the building blocks. Again – osteoblasts and osteoclasts are the construction workers. For people with osteoporosis or osteopenia (bone less dense than normal but not yet osteoporosis) just supplying more building blocks (calcium and vit D) may not be enough. You may need meds to slow down osteoclasts and/or speed up osteoblasts. I had a couple health food folks tell me calcium and vitamin D alone would "cure" my osteoporosis (which is severe for my age). That is not true. I have actually been active and taken calcium with D for years. I needed to speed up the builders and slow down the distruction crew, too. Piling more bricks on the situation was not enough to speed the building. A bone scan is the only accurate way to know what degree of bone loss you have – and the tool used to follow progress. Had I just done calcium and D, as this well-meaning person suggested, it would have meant I would have lost a lot more bone. And once bone is lost – there is only one med on the market that will speed up the osteoblasts and that is reserved for severe forms of the illness and requires daily shots. So – best to catch it earlier. At the same time – speeding up the building or slowing down the distruction crew will not help if there are no building blocks. So – again – I encourage a bone scan and following with an MD – then use the naturals to supplement the treatment. I would give anything if I had asked for a scan 5-10 years earlier, before I lost so much bone. There is a real risk of serious disability in my future now – though I am hopeful that the new meds will prevent this. C

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